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	<title>Comments on: Fraga Tower Begins The Process</title>
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	<description>If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen. â€” Samuel Adams</description>
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		<title>By: Clarence Young</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21608</link>
		<dc:creator>Clarence Young</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 17:50:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5675#comment-21608</guid>
		<description>One person is okay with it. One is not. 

I am pro choice.

Let the person spending the money decide. 

Just don&#039;t build it on set-aside park land. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One person is okay with it. One is not. </p>
<p>I am pro choice.</p>
<p>Let the person spending the money decide. </p>
<p>Just don&#8217;t build it on set-aside park land. <img src='http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Rate this comment: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-21608" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21608', 'add', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-21608-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-21608" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21608', 'subtract', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-21608-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: velmeeta</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21601</link>
		<dc:creator>velmeeta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 15:32:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5675#comment-21601</guid>
		<description>Not in Asheville to date.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not in Asheville to date.</p>
<p>Rate this comment: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-21601" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21601', 'add', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-21601-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-21601" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21601', 'subtract', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-21601-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: velmeeta</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21600</link>
		<dc:creator>velmeeta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 15:29:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5675#comment-21600</guid>
		<description>Is Mr. Fraga still working on his vision for Westgate? He seems fairly competent at garnering media attention for his grandiose plans- none of which have resulted in any actual construction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is Mr. Fraga still working on his vision for Westgate? He seems fairly competent at garnering media attention for his grandiose plans- none of which have resulted in any actual construction.</p>
<p>Rate this comment: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-21600" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21600', 'add', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-21600-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-21600" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21600', 'subtract', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-21600-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Low Key</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21598</link>
		<dc:creator>Low Key</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 14:13:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5675#comment-21598</guid>
		<description>Up, not out.

There should be a few restrictions to prevent another monstrosity like the BB&amp;T building - but otherwise I support tall buildings in downtown.

I&#039;m not too worried about gentrification. Their are many creative solutions to that problem, provided voters and elected officials have the courage to implement them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Up, not out.</p>
<p>There should be a few restrictions to prevent another monstrosity like the BB&amp;T building &#8211; but otherwise I support tall buildings in downtown.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not too worried about gentrification. Their are many creative solutions to that problem, provided voters and elected officials have the courage to implement them.</p>
<p>Rate this comment: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-21598" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21598', 'add', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-21598-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-21598" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21598', 'subtract', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-21598-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Lindsey</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21597</link>
		<dc:creator>Lindsey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:33:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The downtown master plan is going to be finished in like 3 months.  We should not be talking about anything of this scale until we get that completed.

Also, is there a market demand for more of this stuff?  I mean, the Zona lofts are now failing and that was a good project.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The downtown master plan is going to be finished in like 3 months.  We should not be talking about anything of this scale until we get that completed.</p>
<p>Also, is there a market demand for more of this stuff?  I mean, the Zona lofts are now failing and that was a good project.</p>
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		<title>By: David Lynch</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21596</link>
		<dc:creator>David Lynch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 13:22:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5675#comment-21596</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not as conflicted - I believe adding 20+ story towers to our cityscape is inappropriate given the size of our downtown.

I remember reading about Fraga and how this is his &quot;legacy&quot; project, and had a chuckle realizing he wants to be remembered by a huge concrete and glass phallus rising up from uptown Asheville.

Aesthetics aside, there are many issues in my mind that need to be considered regarding this project:

1) Proximity to Pritchard Park. Before the economy drove my business home, I had a wonderful office atop the Flatiron Building, overlooking Pritchard Park. Whenever there was an event in the park, I could not avoid listening to it. The sound was amazing loud, even from 8 floors above. Nearby condo owners discovered the same thing, and complained about the noise, especially emanating from the drum circle. Those these buildings are a few blocks from the park, owners of south-facing units above 8-9 stories will be able to hear the merriment emanating from the park at a level much louder than they expect. This could lead to a growing lobby of &quot;anti-noisers&quot; that could eventually succeed in shutting down the more lively events in the uptown area. On a positive note, at least this one isn&#039;t near City-County Plaza.

2) Parking. The area around Grove Arcade/Haywood/Battery Park/Wall Street is already a notoriously challenging place to park a vehicle. I&#039;m not sure whether Fraga&#039;s plans include the addition of enough parking spaces to accommodate the additional surge in traffic the buildings will cause. The development will impact street traffic, to be sure, but the last thing needed in that area are more vehicles searching for street parking. Though condo owners will assuredly have private parking spaces, what about their guests? People patronizing additional retail associated with the project? I&#039;m not convinced that Fraga has addressed all these issues.

3) Shade issues. These buildings will cast shadows extending for blocks, especially in the winter, as will the Ellington. Icy roads will remain icy for longer periods, and nearby streets won&#039;t enjoy as much sunshine. Should downtown become more densely populated with buildings of this height, it will become a dark place, and we&#039;ll just have to imagine the nearby mountains we can&#039;t see.


4) Appropriate scale. I&#039;m all for increased downtown density, too. But I don&#039;t see why we can&#039;t limit development to a reasonable vertical scale. These 20+ story skyscrapers are way out of scale even compared to our most iconic eyesore, the BB&amp;T building. Why can&#039;t we infill the area with buildings under 10 stories tall? That would still allow for a dramatic increase in density without blotting out the sky.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not as conflicted &#8211; I believe adding 20+ story towers to our cityscape is inappropriate given the size of our downtown.</p>
<p>I remember reading about Fraga and how this is his &#8220;legacy&#8221; project, and had a chuckle realizing he wants to be remembered by a huge concrete and glass phallus rising up from uptown Asheville.</p>
<p>Aesthetics aside, there are many issues in my mind that need to be considered regarding this project:</p>
<p>1) Proximity to Pritchard Park. Before the economy drove my business home, I had a wonderful office atop the Flatiron Building, overlooking Pritchard Park. Whenever there was an event in the park, I could not avoid listening to it. The sound was amazing loud, even from 8 floors above. Nearby condo owners discovered the same thing, and complained about the noise, especially emanating from the drum circle. Those these buildings are a few blocks from the park, owners of south-facing units above 8-9 stories will be able to hear the merriment emanating from the park at a level much louder than they expect. This could lead to a growing lobby of &#8220;anti-noisers&#8221; that could eventually succeed in shutting down the more lively events in the uptown area. On a positive note, at least this one isn&#8217;t near City-County Plaza.</p>
<p>2) Parking. The area around Grove Arcade/Haywood/Battery Park/Wall Street is already a notoriously challenging place to park a vehicle. I&#8217;m not sure whether Fraga&#8217;s plans include the addition of enough parking spaces to accommodate the additional surge in traffic the buildings will cause. The development will impact street traffic, to be sure, but the last thing needed in that area are more vehicles searching for street parking. Though condo owners will assuredly have private parking spaces, what about their guests? People patronizing additional retail associated with the project? I&#8217;m not convinced that Fraga has addressed all these issues.</p>
<p>3) Shade issues. These buildings will cast shadows extending for blocks, especially in the winter, as will the Ellington. Icy roads will remain icy for longer periods, and nearby streets won&#8217;t enjoy as much sunshine. Should downtown become more densely populated with buildings of this height, it will become a dark place, and we&#8217;ll just have to imagine the nearby mountains we can&#8217;t see.</p>
<p>4) Appropriate scale. I&#8217;m all for increased downtown density, too. But I don&#8217;t see why we can&#8217;t limit development to a reasonable vertical scale. These 20+ story skyscrapers are way out of scale even compared to our most iconic eyesore, the BB&amp;T building. Why can&#8217;t we infill the area with buildings under 10 stories tall? That would still allow for a dramatic increase in density without blotting out the sky.</p>
<p>Rate this comment: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-21596" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21596', 'add', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-21596-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-21596" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21596', 'subtract', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-21596-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: bobaloo</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21595</link>
		<dc:creator>bobaloo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:55:57 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Build it. Up not out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Build it. Up not out.</p>
<p>Rate this comment: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-21595" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21595', 'add', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_');" title="" /> <span id="karma-21595-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</span>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-21595" src="http://scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/2_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('21595', 'subtract', 'scrutinyhooligans.us/wordpress/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '2_14_')" title="" /> <span id="karma-21595-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</span></p>]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: uptown ruler</title>
		<link>http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/06/27/fraga-tower-begins-the-process/comment-page-1/#comment-21592</link>
		<dc:creator>uptown ruler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jun 2008 12:02:42 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>my personal feeling is better up than out.

my question is do we really need more hotels and expensive apartment complexes when the national economy is tanking and the price of gasoline ever rising?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>my personal feeling is better up than out.</p>
<p>my question is do we really need more hotels and expensive apartment complexes when the national economy is tanking and the price of gasoline ever rising?</p>
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