Comments on: Shuler: Yes To Big Telecom, Maybe To HRC, No to Torture http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/03/16/shuler-yes-to-big-telecom-maybe-to-hrc-no-to-torture/ If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen. — Samuel Adams Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:24:30 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Gordon Smith http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/03/16/shuler-yes-to-big-telecom-maybe-to-hrc-no-to-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-18970 Gordon Smith Tue, 18 Mar 2008 12:54:41 +0000 http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5092#comment-18970 Chad, Mumpower wants us to stay in Iraq as long as McCain and Bush, right? Shuler's given lip service and a few votes to trying to get us out. Chad,

Mumpower wants us to stay in Iraq as long as McCain and Bush, right? Shuler’s given lip service and a few votes to trying to get us out.

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]]> By: Chad http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/03/16/shuler-yes-to-big-telecom-maybe-to-hrc-no-to-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-18967 Chad Tue, 18 Mar 2008 05:57:55 +0000 http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5092#comment-18967 No surprise that Mumpower came out against it. Right or wrong, he has a bit of a Ron Paul streak in him that will help him with some and might hurt him with others, if one of his primary opponents tries to go that route. I haven't read up on Heath Shuler's views on the Iraq war, but if Shuler believes it was a correct/justified war to prosecute, he could well run to the right of Mumpower (who says it wasn't) on that aspect and nullify whatever stain his opposition to the surge might give him in the eyes of conservatives. No surprise that Mumpower came out against it. Right or wrong, he has a bit of a Ron Paul streak in him that will help him with some and might hurt him with others, if one of his primary opponents tries to go that route.

I haven’t read up on Heath Shuler’s views on the Iraq war, but if Shuler believes it was a correct/justified war to prosecute, he could well run to the right of Mumpower (who says it wasn’t) on that aspect and nullify whatever stain his opposition to the surge might give him in the eyes of conservatives.

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]]> By: Doug Gibson http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/03/16/shuler-yes-to-big-telecom-maybe-to-hrc-no-to-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-18955 Doug Gibson Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:34:16 +0000 http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5092#comment-18955 Darn. Wish I'd known that when I voted in the straw poll. Darn. Wish I’d known that when I voted in the straw poll.

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]]> By: Arratik http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/03/16/shuler-yes-to-big-telecom-maybe-to-hrc-no-to-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-18954 Arratik Mon, 17 Mar 2008 16:27:12 +0000 http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5092#comment-18954 <a href="http://www.blueridgenow.com/article/20080317/NEWS/88073259/1151/NEWS/Mumpower_breaks_with_Bush_on_intelligence_bill" rel="nofollow">Heck, even Army of Mumpower came out against telecom immunity!</a> <blockquote>Breaking with President Bush and the Republican leadership in Congress, congressional candidate Carl Mumpower has come out against more “hidden powers” for intelligence agencies. “Bad things grow in the dark and government at all levels is trying to turn out the lights,” Mumpower, an Asheville City Council member, said in a news release. “Recent Senate and House debates on Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) have generated widespread debate on the necessity of government actions shrouded in secrecy. “The more liberties we grant government agencies, the less liberty we find in the hands of people,” he said. “I am not in favor of the immunity found in recent FISA legislation for telecoms or anyone else and continue to believe that the pervasive bureaucratic dysfunction of America’s intelligence agencies offer few incentives for more hidden powers. “Terror threats are real, but there are many productive things we can do to protect America from those threats before we surrender the rule of law and personal freedoms.” Bush has strongly supported a FISA bill that grants immunity to phone companies that turn over records in intelligence cases. Mumpower said securing borders, enforcing existing laws and audits of intelligence agencies will do more to protect the U.S. than allowing the government “to expand its veil of secrecy.” “Transparency is one of the most crucial components of our constitutional Republic,” he said. “I will be no part of exchanging the light of our tomorrows for a placebo of questionable security today.”</blockquote> Heck, even Army of Mumpower came out against telecom immunity!

Breaking with President Bush and the Republican leadership in Congress, congressional candidate Carl Mumpower has come out against more “hidden powers” for intelligence agencies.

“Bad things grow in the dark and government at all levels is trying to turn out the lights,” Mumpower, an Asheville City Council member, said in a news release. “Recent Senate and House debates on Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) have generated widespread debate on the necessity of government actions shrouded in secrecy.

“The more liberties we grant government agencies, the less liberty we find in the hands of people,” he said. “I am not in favor of the immunity found in recent FISA legislation for telecoms or anyone else and continue to believe that the pervasive bureaucratic dysfunction of America’s intelligence agencies offer few incentives for more hidden powers.

“Terror threats are real, but there are many productive things we can do to protect America from those threats before we surrender the rule of law and personal freedoms.”

Bush has strongly supported a FISA bill that grants immunity to phone companies that turn over records in intelligence cases.

Mumpower said securing borders, enforcing existing laws and audits of intelligence agencies will do more to protect the U.S. than allowing the government “to expand its veil of secrecy.”

“Transparency is one of the most crucial components of our constitutional Republic,” he said. “I will be no part of exchanging the light of our tomorrows for a placebo of questionable security today.”

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]]> By: Doug Gibson http://scrutinyhooligans.us/2008/03/16/shuler-yes-to-big-telecom-maybe-to-hrc-no-to-torture/comment-page-1/#comment-18947 Doug Gibson Mon, 17 Mar 2008 03:24:34 +0000 http://www.scrutinyhooligans.us/?p=5092#comment-18947 Shuler's vote on the FISA bill is and will probably always be a mystery to me. I've never understood why anyone would support telecom amnesty out of principle, so at first I thought Shuler was just staying in solidarity with the other Blue Dogs, some of whom might need telecom money to get re-elected. But since most of them lined up with the rest of the Democrats, that can't be the reason. Even 16 of the 21 Blue Dogs who signed that letter to Pelosi changed their positions. Steny Hoyer was standing with the Democratic majority and rebutting Bush's fear-mongering. It'd be interesting to know how much public pressure (phone calls, etc.) Shuler was getting in the other direction on this bill. Because I can't imagine that there was anyone out there so keen to give the telecoms amnesty. And if I'm right and there wasn't, where did this decision come from? If we look at the 2008 campaign finance records and see that Shuler got a huge chunk of change from the telecom companies (something along the lines of Rockefeller's $42,000), then I'll be extremely disappointed. Shuler’s vote on the FISA bill is and will probably always be a mystery to me. I’ve never understood why anyone would support telecom amnesty out of principle, so at first I thought Shuler was just staying in solidarity with the other Blue Dogs, some of whom might need telecom money to get re-elected.

But since most of them lined up with the rest of the Democrats, that can’t be the reason. Even 16 of the 21 Blue Dogs who signed that letter to Pelosi changed their positions. Steny Hoyer was standing with the Democratic majority and rebutting Bush’s fear-mongering.

It’d be interesting to know how much public pressure (phone calls, etc.) Shuler was getting in the other direction on this bill. Because I can’t imagine that there was anyone out there so keen to give the telecoms amnesty. And if I’m right and there wasn’t, where did this decision come from?

If we look at the 2008 campaign finance records and see that Shuler got a huge chunk of change from the telecom companies (something along the lines of Rockefeller’s $42,000), then I’ll be extremely disappointed.

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