Shuler and Most Democrats Vote For Troop Pullout, Against Waterboarding
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Bush asked for $200 Billion dollars. Congress is giving him $50 Billion with conditions of beginning troop withdrawal, allowing soldiers ample time home between deployments, and recognizing that waterboarding is torture. Bush will veto the bill and call Dems troop hating jihadists, but that’s the way the cookie crumbles these days in Washington.
CNN: “The Democratic-controlled U.S. House Wednesday approved a war-funding bill with a timeline for troop withdrawal from Iraq and substantially less funds to conduct the war than President Bush has requested.
Sen. Harry Reid says restrictions must be part of the bill or “the president won’t get his $50 billion.”
The 218-203 vote was largely along party lines.
Fifteen Democrats joined Republicans in voting against the bill while four Republicans voted in favor of it. The vote was far short of the two-thirds majority needed to override a presidential veto, which Bush has threatened.
The bill states that the primary purpose of the money “should be to transition the mission of United States Armed Forces in Iraq and undertake their redeployment.”
It demands that Bush begin withdrawing troops from Iraq within 30 days of passage, with a goal of having American combat troops out of Iraq by December 15, 2008.
The $50 billion “bridge fund” is about a quarter of the nearly $200 billion the Bush administration has requested to pay for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan for 2008. Most of the money is slated for Iraq, where the Pentagon estimates the cost of its operations at about $10 billion a month.
“The fact is, we can no longer militarily sustain the deployment in Iraq,” said House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-California. “Staying there in the manner we are there is no longer an option.”
[...]
The legislation also would require the Pentagon to give troops the same amount of time at home as they were deployed into combat, and bans government agents from using “waterboarding” — a technique the United States once prosecuted as a war crime — against suspected terrorists.”
This vote follows the Defense Dept. appropriation bill, which passed last week without a hitch. The Defense appropriation will ensure that our troops have all the beans and bullets they’ll need.
The logical step, if Dems are serious about ending the war, is to actually defund it and force Bush’s hand. If he keeps troops in Iraq without funding, then it’s his intransigence that’s endangering them. I don’t expect Dems like Shuler and Reid have the stomach or the backbone for that kind of stand off with George W. Bush.
16 Comments
November 15th, 2007 at 10:14 am
A lot of this is just kabuki. Troop levels are at an all-time high in Iraq, and Bush will be bringing some of them home soon anyway. We’ll get back to pre-surge levels, and everyone will be rushing to take credit for the “drawdown”.
None of this is substantive. The surge was always going to be temporary because our military is stretched to the point of breaking.
It’s better than seeing Dems do nothing, but not by much. It will still mean little. It’s going to take someone with real courage to lead these Dems out of their fearful position into a willingness to do what’s right even if it’s hard.
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November 15th, 2007 at 10:51 am
Gord et al:
Keith Olbermann’s comments about WATERBOARDING are worth every second…NOW.
The link is at the top of Cecil Bothwell’s BLOG.
TAKE THE TIME…..RIGHT NOW …to watch & listen to every minute!
http://www.bothwellsblog.wordpress.com/
Thanks -Twain …up in the WINTER WEATHER ADVISED …Northern Mountains of WNC.
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November 15th, 2007 at 11:09 am
More solid stuff from Deputy Whip Largely via press releases:
and
Representative Charles Taylor didn’t bring this kind of money home, and he was a “cardinal” on appropriations. Taylor wanted to cut the national forests, not expand them. Candidates Mumpower, Campbell, and Armor wouldn’t approve of any of the projects Shuler’s bringing home.
Heath still needs to work on recognizing the civil rights of his constituents, but he’s certainly targeting good federal dollars to bring to the district.
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November 16th, 2007 at 8:21 am
So you’re saying that the people doing the right thing need to do less of it, that simulated drowning is torture and that’s o.k. because it’s “non-destructive”, and that anyone who doesn’t realize that is “hysterical with madness”?
I may need to remind you of a few things:
War = bad
Torture = bad
Living in fear = bad
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November 16th, 2007 at 8:32 am
It’s not the sheep who are hysterical with madness…
It’s those people who go around using silly analogies thinking they are the anointed, self appointed sheepdogs of our society.
Those are the ones who are bat shit crazy from delusional fear.
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November 16th, 2007 at 8:56 am
“THOSE WHO DO NOT LEARN FROM HISTORY ARE CONDEMNED TO†…..WHAT WE ARE LIVING THROUGH RIGHT NOW.
WORK FOR TRUTH & PEACE …and to PROTECT OUR FIRST AMENDMENT.
Twain -in SHOUT mode …on this 11/16/2007
Friday morning.
As I posted the link to Keith Olbermann’s editorial on water boarding…..by providing the link to Cecil’s BLOG…I will add that..NOW….(in 10 minutes)…another ‘Can’t Miss Radio’ 3 hours is on..LIVE…at:
http://www.wpvm.org/
We might hear some indication of what we can expect from the forthcoming ‘Asheville citypaper’……and
THE MUSIC IS OFTEN DIVINE.
Good Morning Carolina…. & and…
GOOD MORNING Scrutiny Hooligan PATRIOTS!
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November 16th, 2007 at 9:16 am
TP @ #4:
I’m guessing that a good percentage of the 17,000+ people killed by the Khmer Rouge at S-21 might disagree with that statement.
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November 16th, 2007 at 9:43 am
Water-boarding, doesn’t “simulate” drowning; it is drowning. Regardless of the ethical questions of torture (which many on the right seem to have no problem disregarding) is the fact, demonstrated time and time again in study after study, that torture–of any kind– is an ineffective interrogation tool.
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November 16th, 2007 at 2:52 pm
About water boarding
I think that a policy needs to be in place equal to the one police forces have with teaser guns. You can ‘t use them unless you have had first hand experience with it ….
so I say everyone that wants water boarding to be used needs to experiences it first hand – from the President down to every supporter of such fascist wet dreams!
Oh and not just for like 2 minutes but the whole kaboom with sleep deprivation, testicle electrodes, naked pyramids etc. – and it could be put on pay-per-view – I bet there are enough sickos in the world that would tune in – it should bring in enough money to pay for this stupid war.
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November 16th, 2007 at 4:13 pm
TP,
this begs the question: who would Jesus waterboard?
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November 16th, 2007 at 4:15 pm
He calls us hysterical?
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November 16th, 2007 at 4:23 pm
At what point do we become that which we profess to hate? If you are willing to adopt their methods (in part or in whole) then what just what is it that we are fighting against? As that freaky old German once said, stare long enough into the abyss and the abyss begins to stare back into you.
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November 16th, 2007 at 6:14 pm
did I miss something or did TP just admit to breaking the law?
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November 17th, 2007 at 8:16 am
And yet they don’t understand why our people are dragged through the streets and their bodies hanged from bridges.
They call that an atrocity.
Expect to receive what you hand out and these folks have been handing it out for centuries longer than us.
The self appointed sheepdogs are usually the first to break down anyway…
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November 17th, 2007 at 10:04 am
“As part of my job in the counterjihad movement, I monitor many jihadi websites and forums, and report on what I find.”
delusions of grandeur? or psychotic break from reality?
PS,
I have no idea what you are talking about with this A-P group… obfuscate much? Oh, and your biblical knowledge of Jesus could use some touching up.
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November 18th, 2007 at 8:54 am
TP,
You are a very important man! You did all that! The Horowitz stuff must make you feel especially proud. Maybe you will teach us all how you organized a protest in Brussels, and maybe when Davy Horowitz comes to town to have dinner with you and your family, you can invite me over. So y’all will have someone to spit on, of course. You sent people to meet with “resistance leaders”
Gosh! How’d you manage all that! You must have sent a lot of money, or you must have gone to Brussels.
Or you spent time on some email lists, a couple conference calls, and wrote a few blog posts followed by self-aggrandizing for the very first time here at this humble blog.
Either way, know that you’ve likely saved the world.
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